Since I use E0 fuel, instead of say Chevron premium or Shell premium (the latter being the BEST according to the MOG), I add the appropriate amount of Chevron Techron at each oil change (5K for now). Maybe I should add Techron more often(?) but IDK.
Fuel Grade?
- Thread starter Don A
- Start date
Most of the time I get my gas at Costco. It’s about 1 mile from home. The options are 87 and 93 octane. If I have a half tank and I know that it’s 93 in there from the previous fill up, I will fill it up with 87. I figured half tank of 87 on top of half tank of 93 should give me 91. There are times when I just put in the 93 because the tank is real low.
- Nov 27, 2025
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- 2026 Land Cruiser premium, 2017 Subaru Forester Touring, 2010 Toyota Tacoma base 4x4, 1972 MGB, 1963 MGB.
Makes sense.
Wasn't expecting it but apparently Costco is Top Tier+ gas.
TOP TIER™ Announces New TOP TIER™+ Standard - TOP TIER™
TOP TIER™+ is an evolution of the TOP TIER™ standard, extending the benefits of TOP TIER™ to today’s Gasoline Direct Injection engines
www.toptiergas.com
Chat made me this list of places to go get my gas from, fwiw
:1. Chevron / Texaco
2. Costco / Kirkland Signature
3. Shell
4. BP / Amoco
5. Mobil / Exxon
6. QuikTrip
Sometimes I do the same..
I have used 93 octane E0 fuel exclusively in Miss Daisy since she was new. But sometimes when traveling, if I cannot find 93 octane E0 using the PUREGAS app, I will fill up well before empty, with the highest octane E0 I can find, to end up with something around 90 or 91 octane fuel, until I can find 93 octane E0 again farther down the highway.
E0 is nice,,,,but unnecessary.................save it for your plane or lawn mower/yard motors. Its a friggin Toyota built to run on sherpa sweat around the world. We used to get this stuff on the Lotus forums for the 2GRfe. Treating it like kit gloves etc....I said it for years, its a Toyota dammit...just drive the sucker. Biggest weakness were the precats.
Ethanol or ethanol-free gas has nothing to do with octane rating. You can get 87 octane in ethanol free, just as you can get 93 octane, just like 93 octane can have ethanol in it.
Fuel injector cleaner. Good stuff.
I know, but in my market the only ethanol free gas comes in 93 octane (Shell Premium) or 94 octane (Chevron Premium Plus). There is no 87, 89, 91 available in ethanol free. All of those grades are ethanol blends.
Chevron Techron. Still the gold standard fuel system additive. A basic component of many additive packs....been using it for way longer than I can remember...35+ years. Never had any fuel system issues in any vehicle thanks to it.
Feel free to use ethanol free gas and PAY for it. Great stuff but just like those that say Toyota oil only, nothing to back it up. It's all hearsay.
Feel free to use ethanol free gas and PAY for it. Great stuff but just like those that say Toyota oil only, nothing to back it up. It's all hearsay.
Here is a short recap from engineer's point of view:
1) Toyota uses the same engines across a wide range of vehicles. You will find the same A25A in Camry, RAV4, Lexus NX hybrid, ... and the list goes on. The T24A is used in the LC, Highlander, 4Runner, Lexus TX, ... and dozen more. Some specify Regular, other require Premium. Same engine doesn't mean identical tuning. Without looking at the exact parameters in the ECU there is no way of knowing which engines will run fine with Regular gas, and which will suffer from knocking.
2) There is more to Premium gas than octane rating. While some brands use the same detergent package across all grades (for example Costco), other explicitly state that Premium has different additives package (Shell, Circle K). Without knowing the specific formulation, using Premium guarantees that you get the best additives package available at that particular retailer.
Toyota cares about reputation and they want some vehicles to last longer and be less likely to suffer issues than other. That's why you get longer warranty with Lexus than with Toyota, in spite of having same engine and transmission.
There is no question that an engine will remain healthier for longer when running Premium. How big is the difference (10%, 20%, ...), only Toyota knows. Unless somebody in this forum wants to buy two identical cars, and run one on Regular and one on Premium for 300k miles.
If you are planning to keep your LC for only a few years, running Premium vs. Regular probably won't make a difference for you, but may make difference for the next owner. If you are planning to maximize your LC's reliability and longevity, use Premium.
If you buy a $60k or $70k vehicle and then can't afford Premium, you clearly bought a wrong vehicle. You should have stuck with something cheaper.
1) Toyota uses the same engines across a wide range of vehicles. You will find the same A25A in Camry, RAV4, Lexus NX hybrid, ... and the list goes on. The T24A is used in the LC, Highlander, 4Runner, Lexus TX, ... and dozen more. Some specify Regular, other require Premium. Same engine doesn't mean identical tuning. Without looking at the exact parameters in the ECU there is no way of knowing which engines will run fine with Regular gas, and which will suffer from knocking.
2) There is more to Premium gas than octane rating. While some brands use the same detergent package across all grades (for example Costco), other explicitly state that Premium has different additives package (Shell, Circle K). Without knowing the specific formulation, using Premium guarantees that you get the best additives package available at that particular retailer.
Toyota cares about reputation and they want some vehicles to last longer and be less likely to suffer issues than other. That's why you get longer warranty with Lexus than with Toyota, in spite of having same engine and transmission.
There is no question that an engine will remain healthier for longer when running Premium. How big is the difference (10%, 20%, ...), only Toyota knows. Unless somebody in this forum wants to buy two identical cars, and run one on Regular and one on Premium for 300k miles.
If you are planning to keep your LC for only a few years, running Premium vs. Regular probably won't make a difference for you, but may make difference for the next owner. If you are planning to maximize your LC's reliability and longevity, use Premium.
If you buy a $60k or $70k vehicle and then can't afford Premium, you clearly bought a wrong vehicle. You should have stuck with something cheaper.
I have some actual dyno data that might be useful here.
I tested a completely stock, non-hybrid 2026 4Runner on both 86 and 91 octane. Same truck, same dyno, same factory calibration.
Switching to 91 produced just over 13 additional wheel horsepower and approximately 10 lb-ft of torque. The curves started separating around 4,200 RPM, with the 91 maintaining its advantage through the upper RPM range.
The LC250 uses the same T24A-FTS engine, although the Land Cruiser is hybrid and this 4Runner was not. The calibrations and overall powertrains differ, but the underlying engine is the same.
These are 11:1 compression ratio turbocharged engines, which is relatively high compression for a boosted application.
Toyota's D-4ST system uses both direct and port injection. Direct injection provides charge cooling inside the cylinder, helping suppress knock and making this high-compression, boosted combination possible.
It's impressive technology, but it doesn't eliminate the importance of fuel quality, especially under sustained load.
KCLV (Knock Control Learned Value) is one of the channels I pay close attention to when tuning these trucks.
Following a learning reset, it starts at 15 and adjusts based on combustion feedback.
Generally speaking, values above 15 indicate favorable knock learning, while values below 15 indicate the ECU has learned to be more conservative with ignition timing.
On the dyno, the 4Runner KCLV was around 13–14 on 86 octane and improved to 18–19 on 91.
That means the ECU was able to operate with more favorable ignition timing simply by changing fuel.
Knock control is an excellent safeguard, but I don't want an engine routinely depending on substantial ignition correction to tolerate its fuel.
When ignition timing is excessively retarded, less combustion energy is converted into useful work, and more heat can leave through the exhaust. This can increase exhaust gas temperature (EGT), which matters on a turbocharged engine with a hot turbine and catalytic converter. Normal timing corrections are part of how these engines operate. The goal is simply to minimize unnecessary intervention by getting the fueling and ignition strategy right.
While still on 86, I developed an 86-octane calibration for that same 4Runner, increasing output from 255 whp / 353 wtq to 292 whp / 404 wtq, while improving KCLV from approximately 13 to 17.
That was accomplished with calibration changes specifically developed for the fuel being used, not by simply adding boost and hoping the knock system takes care of everything.
I retain all factory knock safeguards in my calibrations.
I prefer 91 or better in these engines, particularly when towing, climbing grades, driving in high temperatures, or regularly using the available power.
This graph shows the stock 86 and 91 plus my final 91 calibration. This 4Runner had no modifications.
During light-load commuting, you may notice very little difference. But when the engine is working hard, the additional knock resistance helps it maintain ignition timing, performance, and thermal margin.
Much more great discussion in this thread on the 4Runner forum.
www.4runner6g.com
I tested a completely stock, non-hybrid 2026 4Runner on both 86 and 91 octane. Same truck, same dyno, same factory calibration.
Switching to 91 produced just over 13 additional wheel horsepower and approximately 10 lb-ft of torque. The curves started separating around 4,200 RPM, with the 91 maintaining its advantage through the upper RPM range.
The LC250 uses the same T24A-FTS engine, although the Land Cruiser is hybrid and this 4Runner was not. The calibrations and overall powertrains differ, but the underlying engine is the same.
These are 11:1 compression ratio turbocharged engines, which is relatively high compression for a boosted application.
Toyota's D-4ST system uses both direct and port injection. Direct injection provides charge cooling inside the cylinder, helping suppress knock and making this high-compression, boosted combination possible.
It's impressive technology, but it doesn't eliminate the importance of fuel quality, especially under sustained load.
KCLV (Knock Control Learned Value) is one of the channels I pay close attention to when tuning these trucks.
Following a learning reset, it starts at 15 and adjusts based on combustion feedback.
Generally speaking, values above 15 indicate favorable knock learning, while values below 15 indicate the ECU has learned to be more conservative with ignition timing.
On the dyno, the 4Runner KCLV was around 13–14 on 86 octane and improved to 18–19 on 91.
That means the ECU was able to operate with more favorable ignition timing simply by changing fuel.
Knock control is an excellent safeguard, but I don't want an engine routinely depending on substantial ignition correction to tolerate its fuel.
When ignition timing is excessively retarded, less combustion energy is converted into useful work, and more heat can leave through the exhaust. This can increase exhaust gas temperature (EGT), which matters on a turbocharged engine with a hot turbine and catalytic converter. Normal timing corrections are part of how these engines operate. The goal is simply to minimize unnecessary intervention by getting the fueling and ignition strategy right.
While still on 86, I developed an 86-octane calibration for that same 4Runner, increasing output from 255 whp / 353 wtq to 292 whp / 404 wtq, while improving KCLV from approximately 13 to 17.
That was accomplished with calibration changes specifically developed for the fuel being used, not by simply adding boost and hoping the knock system takes care of everything.
I retain all factory knock safeguards in my calibrations.
I prefer 91 or better in these engines, particularly when towing, climbing grades, driving in high temperatures, or regularly using the available power.
This graph shows the stock 86 and 91 plus my final 91 calibration. This 4Runner had no modifications.
During light-load commuting, you may notice very little difference. But when the engine is working hard, the additional knock resistance helps it maintain ignition timing, performance, and thermal margin.
Much more great discussion in this thread on the 4Runner forum.
2026 4Runner TRD Sport Dyno Results (Stock vs Tuned on 86 Octane)
Had the opportunity to get a 2026 4Runner TRD Sport on our dyno. Truck is bone stock, ~3,000 miles, running 86 octane. For context, I have extensive remote tuning experience with this platform, and have many Tacomas on our dyno, both gas and hybrid. This was a great opportunity to have a...
www.4runner6g.com
While I will always value information from a real dyno over my "butt dyno," my butt dyno concurs. This Land Cruiser runs really well on premium.
If it simply isn't in the budget for some users or they are philosophically opposed to using premium for other reasons, it is not my place to argue with them.
If it simply isn't in the budget for some users or they are philosophically opposed to using premium for other reasons, it is not my place to argue with them.
Yes I agree, a much-debated topic here on the forum and many minds won’t be swayed.
Some vehicles see no benefits using premium fuel, and I would argue that the LC250 is not one of those.
Really appreciate posting your dyno results which confirm ther tests done on T24A engines. This testing was done on a part time 4WD 4Runner (i.e. not a full time 4WD Limited/Platinumt trim) correct? If not, I wouldn't the actual dyno #s/gains for a LC250 would be somewhat lower due to driveline losses of full time 4WD?
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Here we go again with the you bought a $70k vehicle BS......From another engineer's viewpoint, feel free to run premium on a vehicle tuned for regular. Except for the detergent benefit (easily covered with a can of Techron every ~3k)), it is doing NOTHING....unless the ECU will advance beyond the tuned parameters.
So Toyota is using it's premier owners to bolster their reputation?
Ahh but same engine running different tuning with identical specs!!! Open your eyes son. (FL) Prove it. I am as much hearsay as you are on this topic. I wasn't born yesterday.
No doubt it likes it. I bet it feels equally better in a 4Runner...Those aren't cheap vehicles in that top trim either. They tap $70k also....$70k ain't what it used to be. Thanks Donald.
Welcome to the asylum.I have some actual dyno data that might be useful here.
I tested a completely stock, non-hybrid 2026 4Runner on both 86 and 91 octane. Same truck, same dyno, same factory calibration.
Switching to 91 produced just over 13 additional wheel horsepower and approximately 10 lb-ft of torque. The curves started separating around 4,200 RPM, with the 91 maintaining its advantage through the upper RPM range.
View attachment 77166
The LC250 uses the same T24A-FTS engine, although the Land Cruiser is hybrid and this 4Runner was not. The calibrations and overall powertrains differ, but the underlying engine is the same.
These are 11:1 compression ratio turbocharged engines, which is relatively high compression for a boosted application.
Toyota's D-4ST system uses both direct and port injection. Direct injection provides charge cooling inside the cylinder, helping suppress knock and making this high-compression, boosted combination possible.
It's impressive technology, but it doesn't eliminate the importance of fuel quality, especially under sustained load.
KCLV (Knock Control Learned Value) is one of the channels I pay close attention to when tuning these trucks.
Following a learning reset, it starts at 15 and adjusts based on combustion feedback.
Generally speaking, values above 15 indicate favorable knock learning, while values below 15 indicate the ECU has learned to be more conservative with ignition timing.
On the dyno, the 4Runner KCLV was around 13–14 on 86 octane and improved to 18–19 on 91.
That means the ECU was able to operate with more favorable ignition timing simply by changing fuel.
Knock control is an excellent safeguard, but I don't want an engine routinely depending on substantial ignition correction to tolerate its fuel.
When ignition timing is excessively retarded, less combustion energy is converted into useful work, and more heat can leave through the exhaust. This can increase exhaust gas temperature (EGT), which matters on a turbocharged engine with a hot turbine and catalytic converter. Normal timing corrections are part of how these engines operate. The goal is simply to minimize unnecessary intervention by getting the fueling and ignition strategy right.
While still on 86, I developed an 86-octane calibration for that same 4Runner, increasing output from 255 whp / 353 wtq to 292 whp / 404 wtq, while improving KCLV from approximately 13 to 17.
View attachment 77163
That was accomplished with calibration changes specifically developed for the fuel being used, not by simply adding boost and hoping the knock system takes care of everything.
I retain all factory knock safeguards in my calibrations.
I prefer 91 or better in these engines, particularly when towing, climbing grades, driving in high temperatures, or regularly using the available power.
This graph shows the stock 86 and 91 plus my final 91 calibration. This 4Runner had no modifications.
View attachment 77170
During light-load commuting, you may notice very little difference. But when the engine is working hard, the additional knock resistance helps it maintain ignition timing, performance, and thermal margin.
Much more great discussion in this thread on the 4Runner forum.
2026 4Runner TRD Sport Dyno Results (Stock vs Tuned on 86 Octane)
Had the opportunity to get a 2026 4Runner TRD Sport on our dyno. Truck is bone stock, ~3,000 miles, running 86 octane. For context, I have extensive remote tuning experience with this platform, and have many Tacomas on our dyno, both gas and hybrid. This was a great opportunity to have a...
Thank you for this contribution to our knowledge!!
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