I agree, just one correction it's not a motor, it's an engine.
Engine Recalled
- Thread starter Marinna
- Start date
Technically it's both since it has a hybrid drive, right?
Go Dawgs!
TouchèTechnically it's both since it has a hybrid drive, right?
Huh?
Many of us have experienced issues with the LC250. It has been well documented on this forum. Unfortunately, you will have to look past all the “noise” on forums these days. The good comes with the bad. My advice is just don’t engage. Many of us will revert to DM’s to keep things on track.
You are not alone -
We have been documenting issues for over a year.
Hearing a rattle noise at low gear acceleration.
Is anyone hearing a rattle noise at low gear acceleration?? It disappears going into 2nd gear or +25mph.
www.landcruiserforum.com
More than likely it's being trained and learning.
I think there are a lot of people on the board that got bullied when they were young and now is their chance to be a tough guy via keyboard.Many of us have experienced issues with the LC250. It has been well documented on this forum. Unfortunately, you will have to look past all the “noise” on forums these days. The good comes with the bad. My advice is just don’t engage. Many of us will revert to DM’s to keep things on track.
You are not alone -
We have been documenting issues for over a year.
Hearing a rattle noise at low gear acceleration.
Is anyone hearing a rattle noise at low gear acceleration?? It disappears going into 2nd gear or +25mph.
Yeah, fair enough. Excepting the trolls who get their kicks by posting deliberately inflammatory remarks, things can get pretty heated pretty fast whether you are buggin' over a $60k+ truck that just broke down after month of ownership or after dropping that kinda coin you need reassurance that it will be fine and can survive the coming apocalypse, so you're feeling a bit defensive. It doesn't help that car manufacturers have a vested interest in keep the relevant information that could provide much needed context to these incidents a secret (until they can't). We can argue how many is "many", what coulda been designed/built differently, what constitutes a systemic defect vs bad luck. At the end of the day it doesn't much matter since as humans we are more apt to trust our own feelings and direct experiences than abstractions such as statistics. Given it's the holiday season maybe just take a breath and consider that at the heart of things the feelings are authentic and basically the same on both sides of the debate and cut some slack?I think there are a lot of people on the board that got bullied when they were young and now is their chance to be a tough guy via keyboard.
The troublemaker gets torn apart. TL;DR; the thing looks shiny and perfectly fine until it isn't. In the end, the video's author adds even more fuel to the conspiracy theory that Toyota is lying about why the the engine goes 
He also made a not that it was extremely hard to get the core because Toyota is doing its best to hide all the evidence of their engineering crimes.
He also made a not that it was extremely hard to get the core because Toyota is doing its best to hide all the evidence of their engineering crimes.
- Sep 22, 2023
- 185
- Media
- 21
- 263
- Vehicles
- 2024 Toyota Land Cruiser, 2023 Lexus LX 600 F-Sport, 2022 MB EQS 450+
I own the LX, the GX and the LC 250, so I've got a vested interest in this recall, particularly since my LX has been recalled.
The problem I have with the "Toyota is lying" theory is, it doesn't make business sense, and it doesn't comport with their previous actions during recalls.
By lying Toyota raises their legal liability, damages their brand, and burns their loyal customer base. The legal liability is real. Auto executives have been jailed in the past for lying to the NHTSA. Companies have also been subjected to mandatory buybacks, fines and federal monitoring for a period of years for failing to honestly disclose the root causes of safety issues.
Toyota is a conservative company, and I think it's more likely that they are taking a conservative approach to responding to this recall. They will study the problem, develop a remedy, validate it through testing and report it to the NHTSA with a remedy in place.
In my case, if the replacement engine fails, I will ask for a buyback. That would be disappointing, but I wouldn't attribute it to anything malicious.
Speculation: I think this recall will be expanded to include hybrid platforms with early versions of the V35 (TTV6). Moreover, I think Toyota will have to extend the powertrain warranty on the replacement engines to compensate people for perceived loss of value and to inoculate themselves from class action lawsuits.
The problem I have with the "Toyota is lying" theory is, it doesn't make business sense, and it doesn't comport with their previous actions during recalls.
By lying Toyota raises their legal liability, damages their brand, and burns their loyal customer base. The legal liability is real. Auto executives have been jailed in the past for lying to the NHTSA. Companies have also been subjected to mandatory buybacks, fines and federal monitoring for a period of years for failing to honestly disclose the root causes of safety issues.
Toyota is a conservative company, and I think it's more likely that they are taking a conservative approach to responding to this recall. They will study the problem, develop a remedy, validate it through testing and report it to the NHTSA with a remedy in place.
In my case, if the replacement engine fails, I will ask for a buyback. That would be disappointing, but I wouldn't attribute it to anything malicious.
Speculation: I think this recall will be expanded to include hybrid platforms with early versions of the V35 (TTV6). Moreover, I think Toyota will have to extend the powertrain warranty on the replacement engines to compensate people for perceived loss of value and to inoculate themselves from class action lawsuits.
The troublemaker gets torn apart. TL;DR; the thing looks shiny and perfectly fine until it isn't. In the end, the video's author adds even more fuel to the conspiracy theory that Toyota is lying about why the the engine goes
View attachment 54113
View attachment 54114
View attachment 54115
I'm not an kind of engine expert but after watching the youtube video, I assume the debris gets caught between the wheel bearings and the crankshaft when the engine is off and ever turn up rotates the shaft? He also annotates that the two that failed are all different sizes.
agree, even though "I want to believe" 
The troublemaker gets torn apart. TL;DR; the thing looks shiny and perfectly fine until it isn't. In the end, the video's author adds even more fuel to the conspiracy theory that Toyota is lying about why the the engine goes
View attachment 54113
View attachment 54114
View attachment 54115
See, that's what happens when you don't do a 500mi break in oil change.
*
, in case nobody gets that I'm making a joke. That guy has a nice LX.Toyota is lying.
'Material' or 'Debris' left in the oil passages would wipe out the main bearings within the first 50-miles. Instead, most failures are between 20,000-40,000 miles. I've built forced induction engines, big blocks, small block strokers. This is not normal. There could be a half dozen reasons why this is happening, but machining debris being the primary reason why isn't one. That's what they're finding after the actual issue occurs.
Toyota hosed very ignorant buyers for years on the Tundra's, claiming 'fixes' that were nothing more than to get trucks off the lot (you see this in magnitudes on the Tundra groups which are a bit hilarious to read owners defending Toyota). It's going to be near impossible to recover from the dishonesty and deception with the V35A.
Last edited:
For those who are interested in more details, here is the link to the latest official communication from Toyota that can be found in NHTSA website.
RMISC-25V767-8528.pdf
I am going to quote a few sections with my commentary.
To further investigate the production changes at the Alabama plant, the timing of the production change points from that plant was compared to initial results of contamination data retrieved from the fabric swatches. This initial comparison did not identify a correlation between production contamination variability and the engine failures seen in the market.
After the initial recall, Toyota implemented changes to improve the cleaning process. Now Toyota admits that there is no correlation between how "clean" or "dirty" the engines are and the rate of failure.
Toyota completed its statistical analysis of the swatch contamination data collected from the Alabama plant and found engines produced during the period after those covered by the 24V381 recall, but before additional manufacturing process improvements, contained higher counts of larger pieces of debris. [...] Toyota determined that during a specific production period after the 24V-381 recall, there is a possibility that higher counts of engine machining debris of a larger size may not have been cleared from the engine during manufacturing
Toyota now says that the improvements to the cleaning process actually made the problem worse. Hard to believe that they wouldn't verify the effectiveness of the changes considering the cost of the first recall (well over a billion dollars). Sounds fishy.
Two relevant production periods at the Alabama plant were identified between the production period covered by recall 24V-381 and the implementation of a design change to increase the robustness of the #1 main bearing
Toyota now quietly admits that they made design changes to the bearing itself.
Toyota also reviewed the manufacturing contamination improvements at the Tahara plant after the period covered by recall 24V-381 and confirmed that the production process was generally unchanged for this period. In addition, Toyota conducted component testing to introduce debris pieces of various sizes to the #1 main bearing to study the robustness of the #1
main bearing for engines produced. [...] For the Tahara plant, data from the recovered engines, study about the bearing robustness, and the field performance data indicate that an increased level of this type of debris is present in engines produced between recall 24V-381 and the implementation of the improvement to the #1 main bearing.
This is golden. So on one hand, Toyota says that no further changes to the cleaning process were made at Tahara beyond the initial changes after the 2024 recall. Just like in Alabama, these changes increased the level of debris. But then, the debris suddenly stopped being problem after improvements to #1 bearing. So what is really the root cause of the problem? The debris or the bearing?
Based on the bits and pieces of information that Toyota included in this official communication it casts doubt about machining debris being the root cause of the problem. My take is:
RMISC-25V767-8528.pdf
I am going to quote a few sections with my commentary.
To further investigate the production changes at the Alabama plant, the timing of the production change points from that plant was compared to initial results of contamination data retrieved from the fabric swatches. This initial comparison did not identify a correlation between production contamination variability and the engine failures seen in the market.
After the initial recall, Toyota implemented changes to improve the cleaning process. Now Toyota admits that there is no correlation between how "clean" or "dirty" the engines are and the rate of failure.
Toyota completed its statistical analysis of the swatch contamination data collected from the Alabama plant and found engines produced during the period after those covered by the 24V381 recall, but before additional manufacturing process improvements, contained higher counts of larger pieces of debris. [...] Toyota determined that during a specific production period after the 24V-381 recall, there is a possibility that higher counts of engine machining debris of a larger size may not have been cleared from the engine during manufacturing
Toyota now says that the improvements to the cleaning process actually made the problem worse. Hard to believe that they wouldn't verify the effectiveness of the changes considering the cost of the first recall (well over a billion dollars). Sounds fishy.
Two relevant production periods at the Alabama plant were identified between the production period covered by recall 24V-381 and the implementation of a design change to increase the robustness of the #1 main bearing
Toyota now quietly admits that they made design changes to the bearing itself.
Toyota also reviewed the manufacturing contamination improvements at the Tahara plant after the period covered by recall 24V-381 and confirmed that the production process was generally unchanged for this period. In addition, Toyota conducted component testing to introduce debris pieces of various sizes to the #1 main bearing to study the robustness of the #1
main bearing for engines produced. [...] For the Tahara plant, data from the recovered engines, study about the bearing robustness, and the field performance data indicate that an increased level of this type of debris is present in engines produced between recall 24V-381 and the implementation of the improvement to the #1 main bearing.
This is golden. So on one hand, Toyota says that no further changes to the cleaning process were made at Tahara beyond the initial changes after the 2024 recall. Just like in Alabama, these changes increased the level of debris. But then, the debris suddenly stopped being problem after improvements to #1 bearing. So what is really the root cause of the problem? The debris or the bearing?
Based on the bits and pieces of information that Toyota included in this official communication it casts doubt about machining debris being the root cause of the problem. My take is:
- The cleaning problem is probably real, but not the root cause the problem. Toyota might have thought that this was the root cause initially, but the fact that improvements to cleaning process did not resolve the problem indicates that there is more to the story.
- While Toyota does not openly admit that there was (is) a design problem with the bearing, the fact that they immediately started working on a redesign and quietly implemented this change hints that Toyota knew that there was a more fundamental problem than just machining debris. Another important fact is that it has always been #1 bearing that fails, and no evidence of debris has been found in the other main bearings.
- There is also one additional interesting possibility. Toyota knew that the root cause was the bearing, but implementation of a design change would take a long(er) time and, more importantly, force Toyota to issue a "stop sales" until the changes were implemented. So the debris was a convenient excuse to continue building and selling defective vehicles while Toyota was working on the real problem.
Last edited:
Is there an easy way to find out when and where your LC engine was built?
🩹 Land Cruiser Issues, Repairs, Warranty
🚪 Land Cruiser Exterior
🚪 Land Cruiser Exterior
🚪 Land Cruiser Exterior
🚪 Land Cruiser Exterior
💬 Land Cruiser Talk
🩹 Land Cruiser Issues, Repairs, Warranty
🩹 Land Cruiser Issues, Repairs, Warranty
🩹 Land Cruiser Issues, Repairs, Warranty
🩹 Land Cruiser Issues, Repairs, Warranty
🩹 Land Cruiser Issues, Repairs, Warranty
💡 Land Cruiser Lighting
💡 Land Cruiser Lighting
💡 Land Cruiser Lighting
💡 Land Cruiser Lighting
Similar threads
Sponsored Vendors
View all →
Latest Discussions
-
🏆 LCOTM November 2026 - Land Cruiser of the Month starts now!- Latest: LandCruiserForum
-
-
-
-
