I agree with the OP, the torque delivery is smooth, it pulls, but I've caught it flat footed sometimes too, expecting boost and electrons and gotten neither. I've had better results rolling into the throttle rather than stabbing or pining it. I've noticed to the trans would rather have the engine spoil up boost than downshift. I appreciate this because it's a smoother delivery than an abrupt downshift to redline. This engine has enough torque to power thru. It's been a learning curve and like the op it's probably a combo of me and the miles driven, I'm at 12k miles. I was definitely impressed with two lane passing out in Nevada this winter!
This powertrain is a passing beast!!!!
- Thread starter Buckfever
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My wife has a car with a turbo, and yeah, sometimes it just lags a bit. The battery on the LC helps some, but it still lags sometimes
If you press the TOW-HAUL button, the engine won't turn off at stops. But your shift points will change, too. The engine will run at higher rpm all the time and fuel economy will suffer.
Exactly
This ^ has been the best way for me to get the most out of the powertrain - by rolling into the pedal.
I've only been caught with (almost) insufficient passing power once, and it happened to be yesterday.
I have a point in my commute where two lanes merge to one just after a light controlled intersection. I was coming up to the light in the lane that is admittedly the "give way" merge lane, but there was no one in front of me and the light turned green just before I hit the intersection while I was still doing about 20-25 mph. There were four or five cars in the lane to my left and on any normal day my acceleration back to 35-40 mph would have carried me well past the front car before the merge.
But that front car took off like it was a drag race and I had one of those instantaneous decisions to make: tap my brakes and try to merge in behind (realizing there was already a car behind me that was acting like we were going to be "1" and "3" in the zipper) or gun it and continue to merge in front. I should mention there's no shoulder to use as a third option, it's just a drainage ditch.
Rightly or wrongly I decided to "hit the button, Chewie", and the response was pretty damn close to that moment in Empire Strikes Back! I got hardly any more acceleration than I already had and was barely able to make the merge. Shortly after the merge is a S-turn followed by a fairly long straightaway, and coming out of the S the LC accelerated just like I'm used to.
I wasn't looking at my gauges, but I think I just happened to get that spot where the engine had geared up and was already using the hybrid assist so when I asked for more there was little there until the transmission figured out it would have to gear down.
First time in over 15k that I haven't had the oomph when needed.
I have a point in my commute where two lanes merge to one just after a light controlled intersection. I was coming up to the light in the lane that is admittedly the "give way" merge lane, but there was no one in front of me and the light turned green just before I hit the intersection while I was still doing about 20-25 mph. There were four or five cars in the lane to my left and on any normal day my acceleration back to 35-40 mph would have carried me well past the front car before the merge.
But that front car took off like it was a drag race and I had one of those instantaneous decisions to make: tap my brakes and try to merge in behind (realizing there was already a car behind me that was acting like we were going to be "1" and "3" in the zipper) or gun it and continue to merge in front. I should mention there's no shoulder to use as a third option, it's just a drainage ditch.
Rightly or wrongly I decided to "hit the button, Chewie", and the response was pretty damn close to that moment in Empire Strikes Back! I got hardly any more acceleration than I already had and was barely able to make the merge. Shortly after the merge is a S-turn followed by a fairly long straightaway, and coming out of the S the LC accelerated just like I'm used to.
I wasn't looking at my gauges, but I think I just happened to get that spot where the engine had geared up and was already using the hybrid assist so when I asked for more there was little there until the transmission figured out it would have to gear down.
First time in over 15k that I haven't had the oomph when needed.
The ability to run on the electric motor has been a "feature" of hybrid vehicles since their inception...granted, the hybrid powertrain of the T24A-FTS LC 250 may not be objectively aimed at improving fuel economy, but it's still a hybrid none the less, which does require some driver adaptation due to differences in how the vehicle operates compared to one that runs only on gasoline.
- The gas motor shutting off when idle on a hybrid vehicle is NOT the same as an "auto start-stop" feature on a ICE vehicle cutting the engine when stopped. There is no jarring re-start of the engine when the gas pedal is re-engaged nor is there the same of lag when it occurs, as hybrids don't use a traditional starter to fire the gas engine, and most hybrid vehicles can operate solely on electric power under certain conditions. The vehicle and powertrain are designed to operate this way.
- There is no need for a "defeat button" to disable the engine shutting off, because, as stated above, this is NOT the same thing as "auto start-stop" on a traditional ICE vehicle....if it was, there already would be a defeat button, as Toyota has included that in other non-hybrid models with auto start-stop. In this case, it's simply doing what a hybrid powertrain is supposed to do.
- The change in legislation only removes the incentive for auto-makers to include auto start-stop, it doesn't actually prevent them for using it...given that these rules seem to change with every legislation, I wouldn't be surprised if not many auto makers actually take much action on this, since overall the laws do seem to move in a more restrictive direction.
Perhaps some people don't like that the LC 250 is ONLY offered as a hybrid in North America, but that's a slightly different discussion...if you don't, and if you really can't accept the fact that the gas motor may shut off when idle because it is a hybrid vehicle, perhaps a non-hybrid 4Runner is a better option.
And having said all of that, for what it's worth, I HATE auto stop-start on ICE vehicles -- I just understand that it's not the same as a hybrid transitioning to electric-only power.
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I have been repeating the same thing for so longโฆ itโs friggin refreshing to have someone else say it. โI really want to defeat the hybrid part of my hybrid powertrainโ is a much more accurate statement than the nonsense โstop-startโ that keeps being erroneously attributed to the LC.
If the IC engine is off and you can still accelerate, you donโt have start-stop.
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Opinions are fine! But having an opinion on a non-applicable feature is definitely one of the available choices lol
Right...it's like I said, if your opinion is "Toyota should offer a non-hybrid version of the LC" (including any other alternative type of engine/powrtrain), that's valid. I may or may not agree, but it's a valid opinion possibly worthy of discussion.
The idea that there should be a kill switch for "auto start-stop" on a hybrid vehicle doesn't make sense. It's not an "opinion", it's a misunderstanding of how hybrid vehicles are designed to operate.
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Delayed response, yes. I missed this during some business travels and saw it again after a recent reaction to a comment I made above. This isn't about whether or not something makes sense to anyone or everyone, this is about the attribution of something that simply does not exist. I hope you aren't taking it personally, but I don't subscribe to normalizing the acceptance incorrect information simply because someone has an opinion that contradicts fact.
Example: You point to a thermostat and say "I really wish I could disable the starting and stopping of my A/C, I wish there was a bypass." I would say "That's a thermostat, and it was designed to turn on and off to maintain a specific temperature, and you are basicaly saying you want your thermostat to be an on/off switch and bypass the thing itself" (ignoring the fact that most thermostats do indeed have a constant on switch at the expense of the thermostat performing the actual "thermostat" function). In this instance you would then say "Opinions not allowed," to which I would reply "opinions are fine, but don't change facts. If you want your AC or heater to stay on regardless of temp go for it, but you should acknowledge that you are also saying you don't want your thermostat to be a thermostat"
Similarly, if you want your LC to stop shutting off the engine go for it. But, you need to acknowledge that it isn't a start/stop feature you are disabling. You are disabling the hybrid portion of your hybrid powertrain. It is not the same function as other vehicles with a start/stop feature that kills the powertrain at stops, and it does not prevent forward momentum prior to engine reengagement. It would also not be subject to any U.S. laws (as you stated previously) because it is not what you are attributing it to. Those are simply facts, so feel away about it. If that makes me arrogant (which it doesn't, that's just another opinion) then so be it.
On the flip side, seeing as this is the first hybrid I have owned (but not the first I have driven), I have been known to point out to my usual co-pilot โhey- the engine stopped!โ as we cruise on traction battery in stop & go traffic, in parking lots or when pulse driving downhill or on flat ground. She is not amused.
I am not shy to use that traction battery when conditions allow it- cruising along all stealthy like except for the federally mandated โJetsonsโ sound. I had a sales person emphasize to me in preliminary shopping that the hybrid battery in the Land Cruiser is specifically designed to augment the engine and is not intended to power the vehicle on battery alone like a traditional hybrid. I am happy to report that it does in certain conditionsโฆyou can cover a good amount of ground on battery if you are careful with the accelerator pedal. Itโs not a bug, itโs a feature!
I am not shy to use that traction battery when conditions allow it- cruising along all stealthy like except for the federally mandated โJetsonsโ sound. I had a sales person emphasize to me in preliminary shopping that the hybrid battery in the Land Cruiser is specifically designed to augment the engine and is not intended to power the vehicle on battery alone like a traditional hybrid. I am happy to report that it does in certain conditionsโฆyou can cover a good amount of ground on battery if you are careful with the accelerator pedal. Itโs not a bug, itโs a feature!
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