Yep, my prior ride was a Rubicon with KO2's, so it was a quick decision for me to upgrade to the new KO3's.
Observations with first snowfall
- Thread starter gdiep
- Start date
My Rubicon was unstoppable with K02s- looking forward to seeing how the Land Cruiser does with the Open Country AT3s. I got the EV version, a little less aggressive tread on the sidewalls.
We just had a couple systems move through here, both heavy snow and freezing rain/ice. I have been very pleased with my Cooper Road &.Trail tires. They perform close to a true winter tire IMO. However, I have almost full tread depth as they only have about 4K miles on them.
Im rocking the same tires. 275/60/20. I had them replaced the same afternoon I bought the truck; I had one look at those yokos online and said forget it in the PNW and winter travel over the cascades.
I’ve changed to KO3s (285 70R/17 Load Range C) and expect them to perform well. I’ve had the same, in Load Range E, on my Rubicon which also performed great. Since I haven’t driven the LC in snow or ice yet, I’m wondering how much driving improvement is noticeable when engaging the central differential in the winter conditions. I’m sure I’ll learn soon enough, but please share your experiences.
Welcome to the asylum.
Yesterday had a chance to drive in a surprise (although very small) snowstorm with sleet and ice in the dark. Stock Dunlops were fine.
Then got to where I was going and drove up an unplowed fairly steep logging road with ruts and a big dropoff on each side - 5-8" of fresh powder and no other tracks - thought for sure I was going to have problems, zero issues, acted basically the same as when that road is muddy. Very steep part at the end, totally fine - a bit more wheel spin, but fine. Didn't change anything, just drove.
On the powder was going slow (was watching the trail not the spedo, but I would guess sub 20mph, not sure if sub 10mph), on the earlier surprise highway bit, was going over the speed limit, but not blazing - maybe 40-50 on backroads (no other cars around). It is only a short bit on that logging trail, maybe a mile - definitely less than 2 miles.
Temp was about 8F on the way out, and then on the way back was low 30s, not sure if it was over freezing yet when I was just leaving and went back down the logging road. On the steepest bit it slid a little, and as expected if I slammed on the brakes it slid a little more, but as long as I did a slow crawl (again, zero settings on the car, just driving normally) it was fine. There is a bit where it has to park on the hill while I open a gate in front of the car, was a little hesitant there, but no sliding, totally fine.
Seemed like the only way the powder would be an issue was if it were so high it hit the skid plates and lifted the car enough to lose traction - otherwise was very surprised the tires felt fine to me.
I was trying to decide between K03s and Blizzaks and now I am wondering if I should even bother - then when the Dunlops go, get the Michelin Defender LTX M/S2 that I had been planning on (supposedly decent in the snow).
I am sure there are situations where these tires are bad - ice for sure, and last year when it was slushy and I was breaking too short for a tight turn - but otherwise, they seem totally fine to me and my needs.
Then got to where I was going and drove up an unplowed fairly steep logging road with ruts and a big dropoff on each side - 5-8" of fresh powder and no other tracks - thought for sure I was going to have problems, zero issues, acted basically the same as when that road is muddy. Very steep part at the end, totally fine - a bit more wheel spin, but fine. Didn't change anything, just drove.
On the powder was going slow (was watching the trail not the spedo, but I would guess sub 20mph, not sure if sub 10mph), on the earlier surprise highway bit, was going over the speed limit, but not blazing - maybe 40-50 on backroads (no other cars around). It is only a short bit on that logging trail, maybe a mile - definitely less than 2 miles.
Temp was about 8F on the way out, and then on the way back was low 30s, not sure if it was over freezing yet when I was just leaving and went back down the logging road. On the steepest bit it slid a little, and as expected if I slammed on the brakes it slid a little more, but as long as I did a slow crawl (again, zero settings on the car, just driving normally) it was fine. There is a bit where it has to park on the hill while I open a gate in front of the car, was a little hesitant there, but no sliding, totally fine.
Seemed like the only way the powder would be an issue was if it were so high it hit the skid plates and lifted the car enough to lose traction - otherwise was very surprised the tires felt fine to me.
I was trying to decide between K03s and Blizzaks and now I am wondering if I should even bother - then when the Dunlops go, get the Michelin Defender LTX M/S2 that I had been planning on (supposedly decent in the snow).
I am sure there are situations where these tires are bad - ice for sure, and last year when it was slushy and I was breaking too short for a tight turn - but otherwise, they seem totally fine to me and my needs.
That is very reassuring!
Agree with that 100%
I ran into a problem with the sensors last winter, specifically the ACC sensor. It ices over and fails to work. This year, I'm going to try switching to the standard cruise control when it happens. Hope that works. Haven't had an issue with the wipers, but I did find the De-Icer setting in the controls and activated it, even though I wasn't sure what it did. As for tires, I switched at 400 miles to KO3s so no issue, other than that I've had to convince my wife the LC actually does have winter tires on it. She is used to swapping tires between summer and winter.
Had our first "snow" yesterday. ("Snow" in that it's coastal south eastern Virginia...I think many of you would consider it a brisk late fall day!).
I've got the stock Michelin LTX Trails on it and they did fine this morning, which was the bigger challenge as the snow mostly just melted and froze in the early morning hours. I wouldn't keep them if I lived in a different area but they're fine for here.
I have noticed that as temps drop below 35-ish my gas for my commute (30 miles or so, mixed freeway/city) has dropped from 23-24 to 20-21 MPG.
And yeah, those blocked sensor alerts are shit. Even after I turned the systems off I was still getting alerts. Though in fairness I did what I could at stoplights, so perhaps I missed something. I did find it useful that it shows the exact sensor that's blocked, but still...let me clear the alert and have it stay gone.
I've got the stock Michelin LTX Trails on it and they did fine this morning, which was the bigger challenge as the snow mostly just melted and froze in the early morning hours. I wouldn't keep them if I lived in a different area but they're fine for here.
I have noticed that as temps drop below 35-ish my gas for my commute (30 miles or so, mixed freeway/city) has dropped from 23-24 to 20-21 MPG.
And yeah, those blocked sensor alerts are shit. Even after I turned the systems off I was still getting alerts. Though in fairness I did what I could at stoplights, so perhaps I missed something. I did find it useful that it shows the exact sensor that's blocked, but still...let me clear the alert and have it stay gone.
I see in my weather app another 4-6" is predicted to hit between now and when I go up to the range this weekend, so will see if the trail becomes unusable.
The issue with the stock tires is that they are good enough, until they aren't.
Having something better extends the range of "until it isn't" so you should be safer longer.
My hope is that I get "stuck" in a way that let's me find the limits, but I can still like back out of and give up vs like "oops in a ditch" or worse.
I'm not worried about the highway part, just the logging trail part.
The issue with the stock tires is that they are good enough, until they aren't.
Having something better extends the range of "until it isn't" so you should be safer longer.
My hope is that I get "stuck" in a way that let's me find the limits, but I can still like back out of and give up vs like "oops in a ditch" or worse.
I'm not worried about the highway part, just the logging trail part.
Happy wife. Happy life..
That is exactly the best way to do it. I have done that with every personal and every work vehicle I have driven- better to find a vehicle’s (and a tire’s) limits under controlled non-critical circumstances than in an emergency scenario.
The KO3s aren't a winter tire. They're a great all terrain, but you will still lose out on cold weather snow and ice performance with them vs. a set of winters.
I have tires that are hopefully more appropriate than the stock Yokohamas, but I won’t kid myself that the 3 peak mountain snowflake symbol is akin to a true winter tire.
I have true winter tires on my work vehicle, but for my climate and typical weather conditions, all terrain tires have never left me stuck on my personal vehicle. I haven’t tried out my Toyo Open Country AT3’s yet, but if they are even half as good as the K02s I drove on for years they should do fine. It is very rare to see arctic temperatures in my little corner of the world, and sustained driving below freezing is where those true winter tires shine.
I still plan on trying the Land Cruiser out in the snow, but right now it has been too warm to see any.
Got back from my test.
Temp was 6F when got there and 23F when I left.
(I leave to go up there at 4am and leave to head home roughly 10am-noon usually).
The unplowed logging road had 8-12+ inches and you could still see the faint spots from where I drove up last week. Again, didn't change anything in the car, just drove up the main part with no major issue - but it definitely felt floatier in far more spots, wasn't pleasant.
But when I got to the steep part at the very end, failed. I tried "Deep Snow" mode but didn't try others - as far as I could tell it may have actually been worse in that mode - but it does turn off the sensors it seems (and put all sorts of alerts on the screen). I tried to get more speed, tried backwards, tried diff angles - gave up and hiked the last bit back and forth.
Somewhere in there slammed the right rear wheel into either a stump or a rock - sounded bad but I see no damage and the air has stayed the same on that one.
I don't know the different grades or angles, just that the very end is man made, so steeper than nature's usually limit of 30 degrees (or whatever it is, I just use that for shorthand when shooting at angles). Steep enough that the car sometimes has issues even when there is no snow.
They never plow this road, so any snow that accumulates and doesn't melt is there all season - so I think this was my last trip up that road this season, at least in the LC - I will hike it and backpack my stuff up the other times now.
On the way back down it was definitely scarier than last time, but ended up being fine - just went 5mph the whole way down. It was like the lamest rally racing you've ever seen with some drifting at 5mph - fun, but would rather have had less eventful than even that.
Would love to go get K03s and try it next week (or lots of diff tires, now that I have my own standard test), but I am on a road trip for the holidays and given how good these Dunlops are otherwise for my needs, just going to ride out the season and hike my way up to the range on weekends.
Temp was 6F when got there and 23F when I left.
(I leave to go up there at 4am and leave to head home roughly 10am-noon usually).
The unplowed logging road had 8-12+ inches and you could still see the faint spots from where I drove up last week. Again, didn't change anything in the car, just drove up the main part with no major issue - but it definitely felt floatier in far more spots, wasn't pleasant.
But when I got to the steep part at the very end, failed. I tried "Deep Snow" mode but didn't try others - as far as I could tell it may have actually been worse in that mode - but it does turn off the sensors it seems (and put all sorts of alerts on the screen). I tried to get more speed, tried backwards, tried diff angles - gave up and hiked the last bit back and forth.
Somewhere in there slammed the right rear wheel into either a stump or a rock - sounded bad but I see no damage and the air has stayed the same on that one.
I don't know the different grades or angles, just that the very end is man made, so steeper than nature's usually limit of 30 degrees (or whatever it is, I just use that for shorthand when shooting at angles). Steep enough that the car sometimes has issues even when there is no snow.
They never plow this road, so any snow that accumulates and doesn't melt is there all season - so I think this was my last trip up that road this season, at least in the LC - I will hike it and backpack my stuff up the other times now.
On the way back down it was definitely scarier than last time, but ended up being fine - just went 5mph the whole way down. It was like the lamest rally racing you've ever seen with some drifting at 5mph - fun, but would rather have had less eventful than even that.
Would love to go get K03s and try it next week (or lots of diff tires, now that I have my own standard test), but I am on a road trip for the holidays and given how good these Dunlops are otherwise for my needs, just going to ride out the season and hike my way up to the range on weekends.
Impressive how far you were able to make it on the stock tires!
What is crazy to me is that it very nearly did it right at the end (why I kept trying a few times, just felt so close).
But feel that's the limit, so glad to know it now - for me.
Tires are stock Dunlop, 20" stock wheels, and just short of 18k miles on them.
But feel that's the limit, so glad to know it now - for me.
Tires are stock Dunlop, 20" stock wheels, and just short of 18k miles on them.
This weekend wasn't going to drive up that path, had fully planned to hike it, but had some warmer weather and the path actually looked better than the times I had successfully gone up it - looked like some others had (maybe my own tracks, hard to say) - but nope!
Lost traction, the previous tracks were slick, so once the incline went up enough, wheels spun - instead of forward or back, went immediately sideways into a ditch. Couldn't get traction and got stuck.
Aired down and tried every setting - the car made lots of beeps and alarms and generally acted like I had been in an accident instead of driving into a ditch like a dumbass at 3mph.
Got a tow to come, but they couldn't get up, so they winched me out via a tree that was in the right spot - drove out fine from there. Was very obviously a dumb thing and I was lucky I wasn't up a bit further, nobody could get to it so I would have been waiting until spring thaw to get my car back.
Lesson learned!
As I noted, the tires are just fine until they aren't - you just don't know when that will be. If anything, it is was bad that they had been so good - gave me false confidence when I shouldn't have had it.
Will be hiking it up for the rest of the winter.
Lost traction, the previous tracks were slick, so once the incline went up enough, wheels spun - instead of forward or back, went immediately sideways into a ditch. Couldn't get traction and got stuck.
Aired down and tried every setting - the car made lots of beeps and alarms and generally acted like I had been in an accident instead of driving into a ditch like a dumbass at 3mph.
Got a tow to come, but they couldn't get up, so they winched me out via a tree that was in the right spot - drove out fine from there. Was very obviously a dumb thing and I was lucky I wasn't up a bit further, nobody could get to it so I would have been waiting until spring thaw to get my car back.
Lesson learned!
As I noted, the tires are just fine until they aren't - you just don't know when that will be. If anything, it is was bad that they had been so good - gave me false confidence when I shouldn't have had it.
Will be hiking it up for the rest of the winter.
