New from Switzerland / 2.4T in Europe

Antropov · Feb 22, 2025

Hello there, thank you for having made this forum to be around, very useful information in there.

I am a Land Rover and 4x4 fan in general... I was luring at the Land Cruiser for years... unfortunately, I am allergic since early childhood to diesel, so I am only into petrol vehicles ever since I could drive.

As you know, Toyota is only selling the 2.8t diesel in Europe, but I read a rumor that the US-version 2.4t petrol(hybrid) might be introduced in western Europe in late 2025 though. I hope to track any piece of information about that on this forum as soon as it becomes true.

So, anyway, we went to test drive a LC 2.8t last week. I was allowed "10-15 minutes drive, you know, it is a brand new vehicle"... so did we... I know most of people here drive diesels, but I was surprised by the noise level in the cabin. Sure it is a Land Cruiser, tough adventurous vehicle, but the diesel is very noisy. Coming from a BMW 540i (petrol 6cyl 3.0L) it was quite a change. I think for a 100'000 CHF (111'000 USD) car, the soundproofing could be better. As we know, the Toyota automatic gearbox is slipping quite a bit under heavy acceleration, so the noise is quite present. Maybe a petrol version would be the same ?

The LC is clearly a fantastic vehicle. Handling nice, comfort excellent, breaking power soft, but I guess it is more a feeling than a lack of efficiency etc. great great car.

Alternative ?
-Grenadier with the 3.0L petrol: I am afraid by the lack of support and Ineos present on the long term. It lacks a serious crash test. I am carrying my family in that, can't afford to not choose the best.
-Defender petrol. Well, as a Land Rover fan, I do not want a Land Rover as a daily/main car.

too much electronic issues, never ending, never solved, for a price that does not excuse such experiences.

So Toyota is the right choice.

Thank you all,
Antropov

EOD Guy · Feb 22, 2025

Welcome to the Jungle!

D-Train · Feb 22, 2025

Grützi! I think you'll find the US/Hybrid version to be quieter. It's by no means the quietest SUV I've driven (X5's, X3's, Cayenne), but can't say I really notice the engine/drivetrain noise much, if at all. The only thing that is noticeable is the wind noise above ~110km/h. Those mirrors are huge! Agree on the soundproofing, but I think some dynamat in the doors would go a long way. Fingers crossed they offer it over in CH!

gxsandiego · Feb 22, 2025

Welcome, hope you get your Petrol LC. I looked at the Grenadier and it is like a Frankenstein of a vehicle, with parts coming from different places. Also check out the comparison video of the Defender and Grenadier to the LC. It is pretty objective and the LC out performed both in serious off-road performance.

Antropov · Feb 22, 2025

Thank you for your replies.

Engine sound: even though YouTube is not a reference for sound recording, I was quite pleased with several videos I avidely watched of US LC petrol as the exhaust note was quite sexy. Low and deep at low revs, up to sporty song in the revs. Maybe diesel fans don’t mind, or even like the rough and grunt of the diesel, nothing wrong with that, but from the inside of the cabin, the diesel is very present “grrrRRRR”. Soundproofing a brand new vehicle (maybe leased to start with) is always possible but I would prefer keeping the vehicle as original as possible.

Grenadier: yes, I wish only the best to a courageous and admirable initiative, but as a main family car, Toyota branding is a reliable and reassuring name.
And I already have a toy aside. Not a Toy: a toy, a toy car, with a LR S2A from 1963 (petrol 2,25, 74hp…

). I don’t need another « pure spartian» off roader, with no road manners, to add to the fleet ! A LC would just be the perfect choice, ticking all boxes.

So I keep an eye on this forum, hoping for the 2,4T to be granted to European markets.
Of course, two Toyota sellers from two different garages, both were quite definitiv on telling me not to believe rumors from the web, cause themselves had not heard anything like petrol LC in Switzerland.

In short: buy the diesel LC version ! Ah ah… of course !

Antropov · Feb 28, 2025

Just an update to myself about a potential 2.4T petrol engine to Europe. Actually... interesting enough... I misread the fact that TOYOTA Europe shared in an official statement that the HYBRID version for Europe is intended to be attached to... the 2.8 Diesel engine, not the 2.4T petrol, as in the rest of the world !

In German / French / Italian

Zukünftiger 48 V-Mild-Hybrid-Elektroantrieb

Toyota wird 2025 eine Mild-Hybrid-Elektroversion des Land Cruiser in Europa einführen, bei der der 2,8-Liter-Dieselmotor um einen 48-V-Elektromotor/-Generator, eine kompakte 48-V-Lithium-Ionen-Batterie und ein Stopp-Start-System ergänzt wird. Dies wird das Fahrverhalten verbessern und für eine sanftere, leisere und gleichzeitig reaktionsschnellere Leistung sorgen, wobei die Fähigkeit erhalten bleiben wird, harten Fahrbedingungen standzuhalten.

As found on: Toyota Media

Translation in ENG:

Future 48V mild hybrid electric drive
Toyota will introduce a mild-hybrid electric version of the Land Cruiser in Europe in 2025, adding a 48V electric motor/generator, a compact 48V lithium-ion battery and a stop-start system to the 2.8-liter diesel engine. This will improve handling and provide smoother, quieter yet more responsive performance while maintaining the ability to withstand harsh driving conditions.

Media then repeated this, omitting the "diesel" factor:

MPG, emissions and tax
There’s just the one engine option available on the Toyota Land Cruiser. It’s a 2.8-litre diesel engine making 204hp and 500Nm of torque. It’s mated to a new eight-speed automatic transmission and permanent four-wheel drive.

Toyota hasn’t confirmed official fuel economy figures, but you can expect it to be fairly thirsty – around 30mpg is likely. A second engine will join the line-up in 2025 using mild hybrid technology, and should be a bit more economical as a result.

As found on: 2024 Toyota Land Cruiser Review

The "oil burner" is going to be the only engine available at launch in Western Europe but Toyota says a 48V mild-hybrid powertrain will follow in early 2025. Meanwhile, the diesel LC is slated to go on sale in October this year with a First Edition limited to about 3,000 examples.

As found on: 2024 Toyota Land Cruiser Diesel Debuts In Europe, Mild Hybrid Due 2025

So... well, that's no good for me ! I don't want the diesel powerplant... and losing booth floor-space with an hybrid battery (and the ability to get extra seats) is not an advantage anymore. It would have been acceptable if that would make the petrol engine available.

Uuuh !

APIOQM · Feb 28, 2025

It did strike me recently how loud the 2.8D was in a YouTube video. For years North American buys have wanted diesel options, but I'm not convinced that's the way to go anymore with all the emissions systems that are required. I think this negates some of their advantage when it comes to longevity. Our 2.4T hybrid is much more powerful and is no doubt quieter.

Antropov · Mar 2, 2025

APIOQM said:
Our 2.4T hybrid is much more powerful and is no doubt quieter.

Spoiler some non subjective arguing inside spoiler

Well... I am pretty sure that diesel and petrol share the same soundproofing, for cost-rationalisation, maybe the diesel is even better soundproofed, but the noise of a diesel engine is by nature rougher, shakier, if not just louder. This means that petrol car is maybe quieter, but not only that: if not quieter, it is simply nicer to hear from the cabin ! It is like listening identical volume some symphonic music, or hard-rock music... level of music is one thing, beauty of the sound itself is another !

I had a BMW 335i (6 cyl petrol), with M-sport pack, a couple of years ago. The petrol straight 6 was quite loud because of the M-sport pack, and quite invasive into the cockpit. Sexy but quite annoying on longer trips... But that was acceptable, because it was a nice sound to hear. But loud AND ugly ? Just not for me... And even less at 100k$ the concert !

About reliability of the diesel... to be honest, I know plenty of people with diesel 2.8T in former LC versions and these engines are just immortal. They run, run and run. You may have transmission wear, steering linkage issues, rust problems long before the engine shows any sign of trouble. Electronics on the newest LC are comparable to the older versions, so to me "diesel" or "petrol" choice is not about reliability. In the old days, you could argue about that... on the field deep into Africa ? The petrol version was always easier to fix. Carbs and ignition were certainly the weakest elements, compared to diesel, but the much lower compression ratio made the engines less prone to wear... and more powerful anyway.
These days, with turbos on both, diesel and petrol are as powerful as each other.
With electronics all round, diesel and petrol are as prone to failure, and as impossible to fix, as each other.
With hybridation on both versions, diesel and petrol are as efficient as each other.
With high compression ratio on both versions, diesel and petrol are as prone to wear as each other (though this was addressed with very fine industrial processing and wear has been reduced to a minimum, compared to 40 years ago).

The only difference that remains, maybe, is the quality of the fuel: quality of petrol is not such an issue, but bad diesel fuel can be a serious threat for modern engines and diesel must be equipped with 1 or 2 pre-filters when traveling in the wild. I guess this is the reason why the newest LC is available in some countries with the 2.7L N.A. petrol engine ! The most simpler version of all. Only 164 HP !
My dream engine !

2023 Toyota Land Cruiser Prado Vxr 2.7L Petrol | Beyond Autos

The 2023 Toyota Land Cruiser Prado Vxr 2.7L Petrol is a powerful and rugged SUV that is designed to handle any terrain. With its advanced features and durable construction, this vehicle is perfect for off-road adventures and everyday driving alike.

beyondautos.com