Hybrid Engine

[LK up a hill]

Hello All,
I'm in the market for a new Land Cruiser or Lexus GX 550 (Turbo charged 6). I've read the Land Cruiser Hybrid doesn't provide consistent power over long hauls up hills because of it's relatively small battery. We drive to Mammoth Lakes and up a steep grade. My Sequoia with it's V-8 will climb the hill at 75 mph without a problem. Has anyone driven long grades with the Land Cruiser? How does it perform? I'm very suspicious of reviews and would rather hear from owners.
Thanks

 

[lcq]

It pulls strong for a Toyota. I’m in SW CO and it does fine on grades at altitude here. The hybrid motor never pulls for a long stretch. IMO, it feels designed to pull the engine into an optimal RPM/gear so it can maintain. It’s there for extra torque in shorter spurts. To me it feels like it pulls up a hill at a set speed much better than having extra juice to pass on an uphill. Maybe that’s the horsepower vs torque. Had almost one year with mine fwiw.

 

[EOD Guy]

Hello All,
I'm in the market for a new Land Cruiser or Lexus GX 550 (Turbo charged 6). I've read the Land Cruiser Hybrid doesn't provide consistent power over long hauls up hills because of it's relatively small battery. We drive to Mammoth Lakes and up a steep grade. My Sequoia with it's V-8 will climb the hill at 75 mph without a problem. Has anyone driven long grades with the Land Cruiser? How does it perform? I'm very suspicious of reviews and would rather hear from owners.
Thanks

Welcome to the Jungle!

 

[LK up a hill]

Thank you. You live in a beautiful state!!

 

[perigree]

Up I80 to Tahoe from Sac it feels fine to me. I average closer to 70 mph for the drive up. I think 75 mph would be fine, but once the hybrid battery is low, accelerating past 75 felt pretty unresponsive. Also small gas tank might be annoying depending how far away you’re starting from.

Specifically when I did the drive fully loaded (4 adults + snowboard gear ~ 650lbs) it didn’t feel super responsive around 75 mph. The battery was also down to about 2 bars about 3/4 of the way up which made the hybrid system kick on less and less.

 

[RUN-8]

Hello All,
I'm in the market for a new Land Cruiser or Lexus GX 550 (Turbo charged 6). I've read the Land Cruiser Hybrid doesn't provide consistent power over long hauls up hills because of it's relatively small battery. We drive to Mammoth Lakes and up a steep grade. My Sequoia with it's V-8 will climb the hill at 75 mph without a problem. Has anyone driven long grades with the Land Cruiser? How does it perform? I'm very suspicious of reviews and would rather hear from owners.
Thanks

You don’t need all 326HP and 465ft-lbs of torque to maintain highway speeds in a 5400-5600lb vehicle on any sustained grade you are going to find on an interstate, state highway, or county road. Frankly it won’t need every bit of the 278HP and 317ft-lbs it makes on the engine alone.

Is your current vehicle struggling?

The Land Cruiser will do just fine, in fact since the T24A-FTS in the LC is turbocharged it should make full rated power or close to it at your altitude.

 

[LK up a hill]

Up I80 to Tahoe from Sac it feels fine to me. I average closer to 70 mph for the drive up. I think 75 mph would be fine, but once the hybrid battery is low, accelerating past 75 felt pretty unresponsive. Also small gas tank might be annoying depending how far away you’re starting from.

Specifically when I did the drive fully loaded (4 adults + snowboard gear ~ 650lbs) it didn’t feel super responsive around 75 mph. The battery was also down to about 2 bars about 3/4 of the way up which made the hybrid system kick on less and less.

Thank you that's helpful.

 

[D-mac]

Hello All,
I'm in the market for a new Land Cruiser or Lexus GX 550 (Turbo charged 6). I've read the Land Cruiser Hybrid doesn't provide consistent power over long hauls up hills because of it's relatively small battery. We drive to Mammoth Lakes and up a steep grade.

I’ve driven the same grade up 395 in my LC and found no issues other than lower gas mileage. It drove really well in the snow too.

 

[LK up a hill]

You don’t need all 326HP and 465ft-lbs of torque to maintain highway speeds in a 5400-5600lb vehicle on any sustained grade you are going to find on an interstate, state highway, or county road. Frankly it won’t need every bit of the 278HP and 317ft-lbs it makes on the engine alone.

Is your current vehicle struggling?

The Land Cruiser will do just fine, in fact since the T24A-FTS in the LC is turbocharged it should make full rated power of to it at your altitude.

Thanks-my Sequoia is 15 years old with 104,000 miles, but has gone through 3 alternators. The second was a new Toyota alternator. We take the car to places where I can't easily get help and that worries me. It's been a great car otherwise.

The LC weighs 6725lb which is 1100lbs heavier than the GX 550. That's what worries me if the battery can't fuel the electric motors consistently.

I found a LC to rent through Turo. Will see how it does on the grapevine here in So. Cal.

 

[LK up a hill]

I’ve driven the same grade up 395 in my LC and found no issues other than lower gas mileage. It drove really well in the snow too.

Great thanks

 

[APIOQM]

Thanks-my Sequoia is 15 years old with 104,000 miles, but has gone through 3 alternators. The second was a new Toyota alternator. We take the car to places where I can't easily get help and that worries me. It's been a great car otherwise.

The LC weighs 6725lb which is 1100lbs heavier than the GX 550. That's what worries me if the battery can't fuel the electric motors consistently.

I found a LC to rent through Turo. Will see how it does on the grapevine here in So. Cal.

Curb weight for the 250 is around 5500 lbs.

 

[LK up a hill]

You are correct. I was reading GVWR. Sorry

 

[RUN-8]

Thanks-my Sequoia is 15 years old with 104,000 miles, but has gone through 3 alternators. The second was a new Toyota alternator. We take the car to places where I can't easily get help and that worries me. It's been a great car otherwise.

The LC weighs 6725lb which is 1100lbs heavier than the GX 550. That's what worries me if the battery can't fuel the electric motors consistently.

I found a LC to rent through Turo. Will see how it does on the grapevine here in So. Cal.

I believe someone else chimed in with curb weight corrections.

Let me put this into perspective. Mammoth Lakes, CA is where you’re worried about driving around?

That is showing an elevation of 8,075ft above sea level. Using the standardized reduction in air density of 3% for every 1000ft above sea level you’re down 24% up there. That is 24% less air that a naturally aspirated engine has to utilize, so your 5.7L 3UR-FE V8 that makes 381HP at sea level is only going to make 290HP up there, say goodbye to the 401ft-lbs too, it will also be down 24% so you have 305ft-lbs at that altitude.

Plus the Sequoia weighs a smidge more than the 250 series at 5680-6045lbs depending on options.

Because the LC 250 uses a turbocharged engine that is aggressively bleeding off excess boost potential in pursuit of longevity, I doubt the T24A-FTS will have any issues at all making the 15+ PSI of positive manifold pressure required to make all 278HP and 317ft-lbs, even at a bit over 8,000ft. Plus you have an electric motor that absolutely doesn’t care what the air density is up there.

Your rough horsepower per ton is about the same in the LC 250 at altitude as your Sequoia on the gasoline engine alone. You will find that the hybrid system in the LC is really only used during acceleration, and in very short bursts to torque fill in cases where a grade is encountered and the engine isn’t in boost yet. You can watch in real time depending on gauge setup what is going on. I have never had the hybrid battery discharge completely, even on long sustained 6% to 7% grades at highway speeds, because the electric motor is not doing sustained tractive effort. Plus you have an 8 speed vs a 6 speed so it doesn’t gear hunt.

I have a 2007 Tundra with the 5.7L and a 2024 Land Cruiser. On the same grade coming out of the Cheyenne River valley the LC holds a higher gear and shifts less than my V8 Tundra at the same speeds. My elevation on that drive starts at about 3000ft and tops out at around 4200ft.

At highway speeds I would give a slight edge to the Land Cruiser for passing on two lane highways because of how much low end torque you get early in the power band vs the Tundra that needs RPM’s to really get with the program.

The Land Cruiser hybrid system is very diesel like in power delivery, there’s just not a lot of point in revving it out. If you look at dyno charts you’ll see it doesn’t build a lot of power much past 4500 RPM. I Suspect Toyota is leaving a lot of power on the table here by limiting boost at higher engine speeds. They did this with the Tundra for example so they could later sell a tune that doesn’t increase torque output, telling us they didn’t turn up the boost they widened the engine speed parameters of when peak boost is available. End result: it just allows more torque production at a slightly lower RPM and allows higher torque production deeper into the RPM range up top creating more horsepower.

For the sake of being helpful if you ever want to calculate for yourself:

Horsepower = Torque X Engine Speed in RPM / 5252

 

[RUN-8]

I guess you might be pleased to learn that the 250 series Land Cruiser hybrid has no alternator at all. The hybrid inverter steps voltage down from the traction battery to charge the 12v battery in the cargo area.

No belt driven AC compressor either, it’s electric.

I believe the only engine belt driven item on the whole vehicle is the water pump.

 

[Don]

The vehicle has no problem going up long steep grades. I've never been power limited on long grades in the Rockies. It will use boost that it can and will maintain. Going down long grades, once the battery is full, the small engine is not great at engine braking. I've actually stopped on a long downhill to let the brakes cool. I've never stopped for brake cooling with a conventional engine vehicle.

I would probably choose the Lexus for its less complicated power train, unless the large inverter in the hybrid version is very useful.

Anyone know if the HVAC compressor is on an electric motor? Is it a heat pump?

 

[TakaraLC]

The vehicle has no problem going up long steep grades. I've never been power limited on long grades in the Rockies. It will use boost that it can and will maintain. Going down long grades, once the battery is full, the small engine is not great at engine braking. I've actually stopped on a long downhill to let the brakes cool. I've never stopped for brake cooling with a conventional engine vehicle.

I would probably choose the Lexus for its less complicated power train, unless the large inverter in the hybrid version is very useful.

Anyone know if the HVAC compressor is on an electric motor? Is it a heat pump?

Compressor is electrical and powered by the hybrid battery. It is not a heat pump in traditional sense since it is not used for heating the cabin.

 

[Don]

....It is not a heat pump in traditional sense since it is not used for heating the cabin.

Interesting. I thought that hybrids didn't rely on traditional coolant heating for the cabin. But his vehicle does heat poorly in the winter when it's at idle, which is consistent with coolant heating.. I use remote start in cold winter weather and I'm typically disappointed with the poor cabin warmup.

 

[Seadogmb]

Hello All,
I'm in the market for a new Land Cruiser or Lexus GX 550 (Turbo charged 6). I've read the Land Cruiser Hybrid doesn't provide consistent power over long hauls up hills because of it's relatively small battery. We drive to Mammoth Lakes and up a steep grade. My Sequoia with it's V-8 will climb the hill at 75 mph without a problem. Has anyone driven long grades with the Land Cruiser? How does it perform? I'm very suspicious of reviews and would rather hear from owners.
Thanks

We live in the North Carolina mountains where there are ups and downs and turns everywhere. I couldn’t be happier with the LC. Good luck with it.

 

[ultane]

I've actually stopped on a long downhill to let the brakes cool. I've never stopped for brake cooling with a conventional engine vehicle.

Since you’ve had your brakes HOT, do you have a problem with brake squeal?